Nathan Larson/Interview

<Nathan Larson

Transcript of HuffPost interview

Andy: Hey Nathan?

Nathan: Yeah.

Andy: Hey Nathan. Andy Campbell with HuffPost. How's it going?

Nathan: Good, how are you?

Andy: Good, good. So can you explain, like, I guess I don't quite understand from your email, they got the, your, all your sites taken down? What happened?

Nathan: They filed a complaint with Dreamhost.

Andy: Oh, Dreamhost ran all those, or hosted all those sites? Is that it?

Nathan: Yeah.

Andy: I gotcha. And are you actually on the ballot? I couldn't find the, I couldn't find on the election site that, that your name on the actual ballot. I saw that you had filed some sort of paper, but I didn't know if you were fully on board.

Nathan: Yeah, they've certified it.

Andy: They've certified it? Oh, so you're definitely on the ballot running as what? It's the Template:W, I know that. But is it, you're running as a Libertarian as, or an independent?

Nathan: I put down Libertarian.

Andy: Gotcha, gotcha. So, with these sites, I mean, I saw, you know, on, you know, that you were talking about that this is a freedom of speech issue, you know, that their, that Dreamhost would take down your sites. I mean, are you worried about, you know, Incelocalypse, are you worried about like your speech being infringed upon with this being taken down?

Nathan: Well, what happened was, I think Dreamhost didn't want to pull the plug, and they pushed back at first. There's a whole thread about that on, over on IncelTears and, where they were talking about, you know, they were making multiple attempts to get Dreamhost to shut it down, and they kept getting responses, and Dreamhost was saying, you know, we're in favor of protecting free speech. And in the end, it didn't violate Dreamhost's terms of service. What they cut if off based on was, there was just a generic termination clause in there where it said, you know, with, even with no reason, you know, if they give a certain amount of notice, they can go ahead and cut if off. So they just went ahead and --

Andy: What did they say was the reasoning behind it? I mean, was it the, was it the stuff that you posted under Leucosticte on Incelocalypse? Was it the stuff you posted like under Lysander or whatever? I mean, all this is freedom of speech issue to you, but which posts were the ones they were upset about?

Nathan: Let's see. I think it was a mix. Let me see. Because there was a bunch of different posts. Like, they, IncelTears has been covering this for about two weeks, and --

Andy: I gotcha.

Nathan: So they've had a number of different posts on there, and it's mostly by the same few users who were tracking it. Let's see. So yeah, I'm sending you a link to this right here.

Andy: Right.

Nathan: Yeah.

Andy: You sent me an email with the link?

Nathan: Yeah, and that user who posted that, octarinepill, they've posted a bunch of other stuff. But yeah, you can do a general search through IncelTears for Incelocalypse and a bunch of different threads will come up.

Andy: Right, right, right, I gotcha. And, I mean, you, like, you own other sites that are still up, right? Like I think SuiPed is still up and your posts as Lysander are still up on there, right?

Nathan: I think that's the only one left. I think they must have inadvertently left that.

Andy: And, but, like, you own that site too. Did they not go after that one?

Nathan: I think Dreamhost forgot to deactivate it.

Andy: I gotcha, I gotcha. And so, so, I mean, as, do you see like the posts that you do as Lysander and Leucosticte on those sites like just as a free speech issue? I mean, this isn't something that could, like, get you in trouble or something, it's just whether the host sites will keep it?

Nathan: Yeah, you see, the thing about free speech is, there's two aspects to it. There's the aspect of the government infringing it and then there's the aspect of, you know, if there's enough social pressure, then people can get private entities like Dreamhost to take stuff down. So like, a lot of people will say, "Well, if the government's not the one infringing it, then your free speech rights are not being infringed."

But actually, it's a little bit of a mix of both, because people will complain, and they'll say, "Okay, this stuff is borderline illegal, you know, so, and if something were to happen, you could get sued for it, and then you could be liable, or you'd have to defend against it." So, speech can kinda get infringed that way, where it's like quasi-bringing the government into it, even if it didn't actually happen.

And then, like, people always say, "Don't whine if a private organization decides to take down your site, you know, because that's their freedom of dissociation." But part of what is getting them to do that is the threat that the government will get involved, or the government will regulate. You know, people will say, "You need to self-regulate, or we're gonna regulate you."

Andy: Right.

Nathan: But, so those kind of concerns can come. They can say, "Well, you know, you need to police hate speech yourself or we're just gonna ban hate speech or, you know, hold people liable." Like, you know, that was the latest thing on Craigslist. They Template:W, "You gotta take down your intimate encounters sites, you know, even though you're not necessarily condoning prostitution. If it goes on, you're gonna be liable for it."

Andy: Right, but I mean, even disregarding the government for a minute, I mean, like, would you, are you worried about like your constituents seeing, like, you know, the stuff written on, you know, Nathania.org, like the essays that you've written, you know, incel kidnapping a girl, keeping them as rape-slaves, all this stuff? Just, you're not worried about all this stuff because it's a free speech issue, or are you worried that your constituents might find out about that? I guess I'm just trying to get a sense of if this is all just free speech and, you know, what you're worried about your constituents finding, I guess, if you are at all.

Nathan: Yeah, the thing with that is, a lot of people are tired of political correctness too. They're tired of being constrained by it. So I think sometimes people will actually prefer when there's an outsider who doesn't have a lot to lose, who is able to say things that are on a lot of people's minds. Yeah, even sometimes if they don't disagree with it, a lot of times people are more defined by what they're against rather than by what they're for. So, like, a lot of people who didn't necessarily agree with Trump or with people like Template:W might vote for them anyway just because the establishment doesn't like them and they're trying to strike against the establishment.

Andy: Right and, but, so, you think like, have you talked to your constituents at all? Have they said anything about, like, your essays on pedophilia and rape? Are they, they're not worried about that at all? They're kind of more concerned that you're an outsider and not a part of the establishment?

Nathan: Yeah, I mean, I think people are kind of open-minded sometimes. Or sometimes people will kind of avoid bringing the issue up, because they can kind of rely on plausible deniability a certain amount. Okay, because, say I'm petitioning, okay. There are different responses people can give when someone comes and asks for a signature. They can say, "Okay, well I need to look into this first" or they can just sign and, you know. And sometimes they may not even really want to know because if they don't know then, you know, if they find out later, and someone is like, "Oh, well, why'd you sign that?" if they can say, "Well, I didn't know," then no one can really hold them accountable for it.

Andy: Right.

Nathan: See, they, their free speech, or their ability to sign, is potentially jeopardized by social pressure too. They might actually want to sign, even if they have full knowledge. But social pressure could constrain them, you know. And some people will say, "Well, I can't sign anything political because I just don't want to take the chance" because their job or whatever. So --

Andy: How would you, I mean, based on the essays, you know, based on these essays, how would you describe yourself in real life versus what you are -- like, would you say you're a pedophile, or you say you just write about this stuff? I'm trying to get a sense of how you define yourself.

Nathan: It's kind of a mix of both, because usually when people go over the top, there's usually a grain of truth. Kind of like in jest, you know, like when people joke, there's usually a grain of truth to it.

Andy: Right, well I mean, is there a grain of truth, I mean to, there's essays that you've written about the advantages of father-daughter incest and, you know, raping your ex-wife, and things like that. I mean, is there, are there grains of truth to that?

Nathan: To certain of it, yeah. I mean, like we know, for example, with women, we know that a lot of them are really hardcore into rape fantasies. Like, okay, my ex-wife, she was that way. She was really hardcore into rape fantasies. So, like, when people talk about female sexuality and they bring that up, and say, "Well, they really want to be raped," there's a grain of truth to that, because they're very much into the fantasy of it, and a lot of times they'll actually prefer when, like when men don't ask for permission for everything. That was, like, there was a story in the news about that, like Template:W, the schoolteacher who had the sixth-grade boyfriend, you know, she later married. She was saying, you know, when they first got together, you know, he didn't ask for permission to kiss her or anything and, like, she found that stuff hot.

[Ed. note: This is a misrecollection of what the news article said. Actually, according to Fualaau's account, he made the first move and asked his teacher if he could kiss her, and she said, "Only a coward would ask."]

So, yeah, like, the realities of female sexuality, or, a lot of it is politically incorrect to talk about. Like Template:W, the popularity of that. You know, there's something there.

Andy: Yeah, I gotcha. Okay, do you think you could send me the form that you sent in for the congressional district? I just need to confirm that you're on the ballot. I can't find that information anywhere.

Nathan: Well what I have, I have an email from the woman from the election office, Ellen Flory.

Andy: Okay, I'll take that. Yeah, you wanna forward that?

Nathan: Yeah, I'll do that.

Andy: I just want to confirm some information that I have, just to make sure I got it down pat. You're 37, right?

Nathan: Right, yeah.

Andy: You're 37, from Charlottesville, I think is what the election paper said, right?

Nathan: Yeah, I was born in Charlottesville, I grew up in Culpeper, I've lived in Manassas, so I've lived in the 10th district, and right now I'm in Catlett.

Andy: In Catlin?

Nathan: Catlett, yeah.

Andy: Yeah, and then, you have a three-year-old daughter, but you don't have custody, because of that custody battle awhile back, right?

Nathan: Right.

Andy: Yeah. Are you going to seek to get custody of your daughter, or is that just kinda over and done with?

Nathan: Yeah, I relinquished my rights, so it's basically the same as giving her up for adoption. She actually was adopted, so I'm in the same situation as anyone else who gave up their kid for adoption.

Andy: Okay, is your first wife, did she die? Sorry to ask about that.

Nathan: Yeah, she committed suicide.

Andy: Yeah, and she got a restraining order after that? Are you, you're currently unmarried, right?

Nathan: I have a wife.

Andy: Oh, gotcha, okay. And then, it's your second wife?

Nathan: Right.

Andy: Yeah, gotcha. And then, are you, are you still working? Or is this just kind of your full-time thing? Are you still an accountant in Virginia?

Nathan: Yeah, I do accounting and software development.

Andy: Oh, gotcha. What company again?

Nathan: Huh? Like, freelance, basically. Like I'm a, I'm working on web entrepreneurship.

Andy: Oh, gotcha.

Nathan: Trying to start a tech company from scratch.

Andy: I gotcha. Okay, and so, I mean, so beyond, just to end this, and kind of just confirm everything here, like, for the Babe stuff, you're upset that they got the sites taken down, are you upset that they're calling you a pedophile? I mean, that's certainly damning and not something that's standard in any election at all. Are you upset about that? I mean, it sounds like, from what you've told me, it's just kinda true.

Nathan: Like, that word is kinda vague, because for one thing, like, they've done studies and they've shown that a large percentage of men will have sexual responses if they show them, you know, pictures of children and things like that, like, with their -- so, there's varying degrees of that, and like, there's a lot of men who are attracted to underage women. You know, that's actually normal, for men to be attracted to girls who are under 18. So, I don't know. It's just a label.

I mean, "pedophile" can mean a lot of different things. Like, people use that word to refer to child molesters who might not actually have a primary attraction to kids. They use that to refer to people who have an attraction but don't do anything. Like, some of them have an attraction they can't even control.

So, I don't know. It doesn't really bother me that much.

Andy: It doesn't bother you that much -- You were, weren't you -- the court paperwork you put up said you're diagnosed as a pedophile, right?

Nathan: Yeah, and they've been changing around how the diagnostic criteria work because now they've, in the new DSM, they've Template:W a distinction between pedophilia and pedophilic disorder. So, actually that's, pedophilia's not even really diagnosable anymore. It's, in the, under the new standards, they say, you can be a pedophile and not have pedophilic disorder if, you know, those desires are not interfering with your life and you're not acting upon them.

Andy: I gotcha. Okay, well, yeah, if you just wanna send over that document just so I can confirm that you're on the ballot there. I know you were on several other ballots in the past years and whatnot. But yeah, so, just let me know, I guess, if you are able to successfully get those sites rehosted and then we'll talk soon.

Nathan: Okay, yeah. All right, will do. All right, thanks.

Andy: Great.

Nathan: Yup.

Andy: Okay, bye.

End of interview

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